A gentleman came forward to the council meeting tonight during public input (FF 40:00) and was surprised that he was told not to ride his newly purchased E2 Bike on the trail.
He found it ironic because he got a warning from a motorcycle cop.
UPDATE: Someone who spoke to the gentleman before his testimony, said he wasn’t even riding his bike on the rec trail but was SITTING next to it on a park bench when the officer gave him the warning. I guess it is easier to give out citations to people who are not moving š
I also found it funny that the mayor tried to correct this first time inputer by telling him there is a speed limit on the trail. THERE IS NOT! No where in city ordinance is there a speed limit on the rec trail, there are also NO posted signs except one on the 41st street bridge that has been there for over 30 years.
UPDATE: I have also been informed that the rec trail does have a 20 MPH, but it is NOT posted and is just a ‘parks policy‘. Would love for someone to pay me to try to find this policy on the city website, it could get expensive.
Once again the mayor has NO CLUE what is actually in statute.
I heard from a city official tonight that they will be moving forward within the next couple of weeks on a change to the E2 restrictions (and other adjustments).
UPDATE: The bicycle ordinances on the bike trail are a prime example of the lack of transparency in our government. They post NO signs telling people about rec trail restrictions (vehicle, speed or otherwise) and expect people to just pull up their city hall crystal ball and know these things. Government runs more efficiently based on transparency, not tongue and cheek suggestions based on limited information.
But is Park Policy the same as City Ordinance?
I can’t wait for the City Attorney office to bring forward the bill for farming that question out to external legal counsel.
I’ve tried to find it on the city website when it comes to the rec trail, couldn’t find a speed limit. I also checked the city charter, nothing.
The mayor doesn’t understand an ordinance because in authoritarian Dutchland “what the fearless leader says, at the moment it is said, it’s law”.
TenHaken believes in being a bully instead of being a leader.
City ordinances, they make them up depending upon what the mayor needs for his āBag of Tricksā. I know from experience. When I took them to court I discovered there was nothing applicable. The citation had 3 irrelevant numbers. I also discovered there were countless contradictory ordinances.
Itās disturbing that a cop gives a warning for something thatās not an offense. Itās also disturbing that the Parks Department has police power.
The next mayor might address Gestapo behavior and merge the Parks Department under one flag back into city government. I doubt it under Authoritarian Charter.
This matter is becoming ideal for commercial litigation. A prominent E-Bike manufacturer could support an active class. Itās a midsize Midwest city with unsophisticated contracted city lawyers. This is perfect media hype. One certain E-Bike could get lots of free national advertising with their logo plastered everywhere. Keeping the city in court could stall TIF larceny. However, it would only be one small step for restoring democracy and Authoritarian Charter abolishment.
Wednesday July 19, 8:30 am.
Active Transportation Board meeting at Old City Hall
224 W 9 th st.
SF, SD.
Bring solutions and common sense discussion.
If you donāt show up , shut up.
Bike trail. š
Yes, everyone skip work for several hours to attend a 8:30 AM meeting on a Wednesday morning at a place with NO paid parking š
I did attend the last one, and made some suggestions and listened to concerns. At the end of the day, the decision to move forward on policy and ordinances is the council’s decision, and ‘some’ of the changes will take place because of the action of a couple of councilors meeting with the different stakeholder groups, the parks department and the mayor’s office.
Hate to say it, but committees don’t decide anything, the mayor’s office and the council bring legislation forward in accordance with the charter. Until you light a fire under their butts you can go to 1,000 committee meetings and ‘speak up’ but at the end of the day you are airing your grievances to a group of people who have about as much power as you to make a policy change.
If you want something changed in policy, contact your elected representatives, IT IS THEIR JOB!
There is no official speed limit in city ordinances, the only use of words that allude to any topic related to “Speed” is found is under 81.015 which says:
“No person shall, while driving a bicycle or e-bicycle upon a street, recreation trail, cycle track, or sidewalk participate in any race for speed with any other vehicle, except under permit from, and under the supervision of, the police department.”
So, this leaves open the decretionary use of the term, and would allow a Police Offcer, Code Enforcer, Park Staff to ‘cite’ you for speeding if they believe you are riding to fast, or in violation of the code.
Granted these are merely “Administration Citations” merely a civil penalty, which could effectively be beaten in a court of law..
At minimum, I would go before the Park and Recreation Board to state my case for or against the citation, and ask them to show me where in code, did I violate the rules..
I am the gentleman that gave the testimony last night.
I was resting on a park bench when the motorcycle cop pulled up for a conversation letting me know that my electric motorbike was illegal on the trail because it had a throttle. Then he started up his gas motorbike, hit the throttle and he was off. He mightāve been breaking the unknown speed limit too.
The officer did a great job. We had a respectful conversation. I was not issued a citation.
I thought I read somewhere the speed limit on the āRec Trailā is 15 MPH. The ordinance confronts speed, peddling, use of electricity, and use of a throttle. These are the sticking points. The main one is speed.
I intend to do some more homework and revisit the issue again next week Tuesday night.
13wis
My apologies. That was not aimed at anyone in particular but it was my oversight that the time and day are not too inclusive of working men and women.
No worries, I didnāt think you were directing it at anyone, I just wanted to point out that these meetings tend to be a gigantic waste of time because these folks have no authority to change things but the council does and I encourage people to ride them like rented mules.
Terry, excellent testimony. The mayor is incorrect and should not have interrupted you. There is no speed limit posted or in statute, Iāve looked and councilors have looked, nothing. The good news is the E2 restriction may be lifted within a few weeks, now if the rest of the council would just get on board
Well, I do believe the Mayor has every right to engage with the public during Public Commentary. I actually liked the exchange between the Mayor and Mr. Bultje. I wish we had more exchanges like that. I thought the Mayor was pretty sincere, and honest, and understanding in that example of exchange…
This is what the “ordinance” actually says in relation to speed…I cant find anywhere else in our code:
“No person shall, while driving a bicycle or e-bicycle upon a street, recreation trail, cycle track, or sidewalk participate in any race for speed with any other vehicle, except under permit from, and under the supervision of, the police department.”
Iām actually riding the trail daily this week to take in some observations about what is going on along the trail. I intend to revisit this topic next week Tuesday. I will point out that I did stop at one of the parks where they have a map posted along with other helpful information. On the bottom left there was about a 2ā x 2ā square that showed, āSPEED LIMIT 15ā.
Terry, great job by the way, very well presented, that is the way Public Input is designed to be…
When you come back, remind them of this – because of the fact the ordinance does NOT create an affirmative speed limit, NO COURT will uphold “Administrative Fees”. I recommend to anyone who ever gets a “Citation” from a presumed speeding ticket on the bike trail, to challenge it by first:
1) Go before the Parks Board to raise concern for how the trail is being regulated, questioning the citation, making it a He Said, She said case;
2) Then if they city refuses to drop the citation, go before the Administration Appeal Board, basically the City Attorney, and legally appeal the citation…
3) if that does not work, then take the case to the Circuit Court, taking the city to court, to request the city to stop enforcing an Administration Fee whereas there is no Affirdmative Speed Limit set by Ordinance. YOU would win your case…granted it would not be a monetary thing, it would simply be to drop the citation, and force the city to set “affirmative policy”
I am not sure, how the city can force anyone to pay a administration fee, when they really do not have to.
I ride my E2 frequently on the trail and have never had any trouble or been hassled. I ride at reasonable speeds and rarely use the throttle assist. E2 is a lifesaver for older riders, especially on windy days or conquering the big hills like the one near the spillway.
It would be more reasonable to allow both E1 and E2 and then write the ordinance to address persons riding in a reckless or dangerous manner. The E2 ban makes no sense.
i have never seen a gas motorcycle cop help anyone on the bike trail. thanks for years of a whole lot of nothing, ponch